That was easy...

[gitano]

I told my wife: "I am going to be busy for the next two hours cleaning guns. Before I start, is there anything you need done?" Her response was: "No, I'll be grading papers for at least an hour."

Fifteen minutes or so later I emerge from the basement with this comment: "That took about an hour and a half less than I thought it would."

I cleaned the barrels of both the Zouave AND the 10 ga SxS. It was actually easier than cleaning a modern CF rifle. The last time I cleaned them was the first time I cleaned them after getting them. The 10 ga took about 2 hours and the Zouave took about 3. This time, it was almost ridiculously easy. :D:D:D:D:D

There's something to be said for cleaning your BP firearms regularly!

Paul

[Alboy]

Not meaning to be condescending.

I am sure you left a light oil in them.

In 2-5 days run a dry patch to check for fouling or rust, then light oil again for the duration

[gitano]

I wouldn't have taken it as condescending even if you hadn't qualified it, Al. I appreciate whatever assistance you care to provide.

I did indeed oil the bores, (and the exterior), after the scalding-hot-water-and-soap scrubbing. I removed the nipples before cleaning and reapplied NeverSieze when I reinstalled them.

I expected them to be worse because of the way they "felt" as I was trying to ram RBs down the bores after a few shots. Nevertheless, it took almost no scrubbing - two patches - and the patches came out clean and the water came out the flash-holes clear. I let them air dry for about half an hour - muzzle down - reinserted the nipples, and 'oiled' liberally. I plan to let the oil soak in for a day or two, run a patch down the bores to remove any excess, then fire a cap in each barrel.

Do you think I should/shouldn't/doesn't matter fire the caps or not?

Paul

[farmboy]

So how do you clean muzzle loader rifles

[gitano]

There's more than one way to skin that cat, but the following is how I was instructed:

1) Remove the barrel from the stock and lock.
2) You can remove the nipple(s) or not, your choice.
3) Get a large bucket/pail of at least 2 gal capacity. I use a 5-gal plastic bucket.
4) Fill the pail with water as hot as you can get it (boiling is fine) and add a little dishwasher soap.
5) Put the breech end of the barrel(s) in the bucket full of hot, soapy water.
6) Wrap a cleaning patch around a brass or nylon brush of appropriate diameter that has been attached to a cleaning rod of appropriate length to reach to the breech of the barrel(s). Entering through the flash-hole, the water will have risen inside the barrel to the level in the bucket. Insert the patched brush into the barrel all the way to the breech. Scrub the barrel in relatively short strokes - 4 to 6 inches or so - moving up the barrel towards the muzzle. Hydraulic forces will pull the hot soapy water up with the patched brush all the way to the muzzle.
7) Remove the barrel from the bucket and force the water out of the flash-hole.
8) Repeat this process (steps 6 & 7) with a new patch until the patch is clean and the water runs out of the flash-hole clean.
9) Dump the dirty, soapy water from the bucket.
10) Either with a pot of hot water or the water from your sink, rinse the barrel(s) with clean, hot water using the siphoning method as before.
11) Set the barrel(s) aside to dry. The hotter the water you used, the quicker the barrel(s) will dry. With scalding hot water, the barrel(s) will be dry in minutes.
12) When dry, swab inside and out of barrel AND LOCK with oil.
13) Reinstall nipples if they were removed. Use some form of release agent on the threads of the nipple(s) so the threads don't sieze in the sockets.
14) Wait a day or three and swab with a clean, un-oiled patch to wipe off excess oil.
15) Put barrel back in stock.

I have been told to fire a cap on the empty barrel to "season" it so that any residual oil in the combustion chamber doesn't contaminate the first powder charge. I do not know if this is necessary or not. Maybe Alboy will comment.

I have set the thermostat on my hot water maker to 140 F. That is the highest allowable by law in the US. Coming out of the deepsink in my basement, the barrel gets too hot to handle once the water starts "hydrolicing" up the bore. Since I get clean water fast, I feel that is "hot enough".

I have read and been told to NEVER use hot water. That using hot water causes rusting. The person that told me the "hot water" method above was the most "muzzle-loading" guy I have ever personally met, with decades and decades of experience, so I went with his instructions. Others use and recommend other methods. So far, in my limited experience, this works fine for me.

There are gadgets https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/158/1/FLUSH-FLINT you can buy that eliminate the need for removing your barrel(s) from the stock. I have such a gadget, but I have never used it.

What I don't know about muzzleloading would fill volumes. What I have written above is just what I have been told, and what I do as a result of having been told it by someone whose opinion I trusted. It is not "assertion" or "suggestion". It is "reporting". It probably sounds like a lot of work. It sure did the first time I heard it. In fact, it 'put me off' of muzzleloading a bit. However, in all honesty, I find this process less labor-intensive than PROPERLY performed gun cleaning of centerfire rifles. And the only non-water component is the oil you use in the final step. No solvents or other unpleasant chemicals.

Paul

[farmboy]

Thank you I should take the old girl out of the safe clean her up and give it a try. How would one decide how much black powder to use? This is a very old family rifle circa 1860s

[gitano]

You should talk to Alboy.

What caliber is it?

Paul

[farmboy]

To tell you the truth I am not sure around fifty I think or perhaps a bit less it has been awhile since I looked at it.

[Alboy]

Generally my method as well. I will add other possibilities where I feel they are appropriate.

There's more than one way to skin that cat, but the following is how I was instructed:

1) Remove the barrel from the stock and lock. If you do not want to remove the barrel here is another way. Find plastic tubing that fits the nipples snuggly. Go to step 6.
2) You can remove the nipple(s) or not, your choice.
3) Get a large bucket/pail of at least 2 gal capacity. I use a 5-gal plastic bucket.
4) Fill the pail with water as hot as you can get it (boiling is fine) and add a little dishwasher soap.
5) Put the breech end of the barrel(s) in the bucket full of hot, soapy water.
6) Run the tubing from the nipples into bucket with the butt of the gun resting beside the bucket. Using a funnel and pitcher pour hot soapy water down the barrel until it almost reaches the top, let it gravity drain roughly halfway back down the barrel or more. Follow the rest of this step as is, remembering we are scrubbing a barrel not creating gushers out of the muzzle. The wood and lock are supposed to stay pristine. Wrap a cleaning patch around a brass or nylon brush of appropriate diameter that has been attached to a cleaning rod of appropriate length to reach to the breech of the barrel(s). Entering through the flash-hole, the water will have risen inside the barrel to the level in the bucket. Insert the patched brush into the barrel all the way to the breech.Maybe Scrub the barrel in relatively short strokes - 4 to 6 inches or so - moving up the barrel towards the muzzle. Hydraulic forces will pull the hot soapy water up with the patched brush all the way to the muzzle.
7) Remove the barrel from the bucket and force the water out of the flash-hole.You do this by simply flipping the tubing into another container or the ground.
8) Repeat this process (steps 6 & 7) with a new patch until the patch is clean and the water runs out of the flash-hole clean.
9) Dump the dirty, soapy water from the bucket.
10) Either with a pot of hot water or the water from your sink, rinse the barrel(s) with clean, hot water using the siphoning method as before.
11) Set the barrel(s) aside to dry. The hotter the water you used, the quicker the barrel(s) will dry. With scalding hot water, the barrel(s) will be dry in minutes.
12) When dry, swab inside and out of barrel AND LOCK with oil.
13) Reinstall nipples if they were removed. Use some form of release agent on the threads of the nipple(s) so the threads don't sieze in the sockets.
14) Wait a day or three and swab with a clean, un-oiled patch to wipe off excess oil.
15) Put barrel back in stock.

I have been told to fire a cap on the empty barrel to "season" it so that any residual oil in the combustion chamber doesn't contaminate the first powder charge. I do not know if this is necessary or not. Maybe Alboy will comment.Certainly not a bad idea but I personally do not do this. When getting ready to shoot the next time I dry patch any residual oil before I load and then check for CLEAR NIPPLESby firing a cap with the muzzle pointed at a blade of grass to see if it moves. If it does not we start the nipple pick deal firing a cap again a couple of times if necessary. If no movement of the blade eventually to removing the nipple to get some 4F in, replace nipple and shoot out the obstruction.

I have set the thermostat on my hot water maker to 140 F. That is the highest allowable by law in the US. Coming out of the deepsink in my basement, the barrel gets too hot to handle once the water starts "hydrolicing" up the bore. Since I get clean water fast, I feel that is "hot enough".I boil it on the stove but that is merely preference, 140 should be plenty hot. When trying to hold the barrel full of hot water I use a leather piece around the barrel and the largest vice grips I have.

I have read and been told to NEVER use hot water. That using hot water causes rusting. The person that told me the "hot water" method above was the most "muzzle-loading" guy I have ever personally met, with decades and decades of experience, so I went with his instructions. Others use and recommend other methods. So far, in my limited experience, this works fine for me.

There are gadgets https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/158/1/FLUSH-FLINT you can buy that eliminate the need for removing your barrel(s) from the stock. I have such a gadget, but I have never used it.

What I don't know about muzzleloading would fill volumes. What I have written above is just what I have been told, and what I do as a result of having been told it by someone whose opinion I trusted. It is not "assertion" or "suggestion". It is "reporting". It probably sounds like a lot of work. It sure did the first time I heard it. In fact, it 'put me off' of muzzleloading a bit. However, in all honesty, I find this process less labor-intensive than PROPERLY performed gun cleaning of centerfire rifles. And the only non-water component is the oil you use in the final step. No solvents or other unpleasant chemicals.
I agree absolutely.
Paul

[Alboy]

Just a possible event I have personally experienced

Jimbo and I were invited to a pheasant hunt near Coffeeville Kansas once upon a time. It took some doing to OK the BP shotguns thru the landowner. In fact we had changed to carrying modern SxS's and just talking about the place when he mentioned the BP rifle hunts they put on for deer. That is how we came to ask what is the difference then for shotguns?

We were to fly from Houston to Tulsa OK then drive to near Coffeeville. We contacted the airline for instructions on BP shotguns. Bought the expensive version of lockable metal gun cases. Loaded those with our shotguns, a small amount of dawn soap (less than 1 ounce), 2 ounces of gun oil, for cleaning. No caps and no powder as those are explosives.

Gate arrival was immediately interesting. We declared the shotguns. Clerk asked us to unlock cases and show her they were not loaded and we could also put the identifier card inside showing we had cleared at gate. Both guns were kit BP CVA SxS 12 gauge twins Jimbo and I had made. She wanted us to open the breach, then the fun started. Explaining we coud not possibly do that we pulled the ram rods and tanged them off the bore breach a couple of times. Not good enough. After her Supervisor, TSA agent, TSA Supervisor, City of Houston Patrollman, City of Houston Sergeant supervisor we finally found someone with rudimentary understanding of BP guns. The sergeant told them the breach could not be opened but he was sure the guns were not loaded and initialed the form. SHEESH. We also showed and confirmed the soap and oil and that it did not exceed the liquids quotas in effect since 911 and we had NO EXPLOSIVES period.

What naïve guys we were. Expecting that following the rules would work.

When we unloaded and checked guns at the ranch we found our cleaning supplies gone. I am posting the link to the story with pics I wrote in 2005 for those that care to read the whole thing.

http://www.thehunterslife.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3859&highlight=pheasants

[gitano]

Thanks for responding Al. Did you see the range report on the 10 ga?

I remember that trip of yours in '05.

Paul