Wisconsin Hunters Killed

[jchunter]

This is absolutely unreal! It's all over CNN, Fox News ect. thought you all may be interested as well.

JC



5 killed, 3 hurt in Wis. hunting dispute

By JOSHUA FREED

BIRCHWOOD, Wis. ? A deer hunter who apparently intruded on private property killed five other hunters who had been staying in a nearby cabin and wounded three more during the opening weekend of deer season, authorities said.

A 36-year-old man was arrested Sunday afternoon when he came out of the woods, sheriff's officials said. Two of the wounded were in critical condition Monday.

Deputy Jake Hodgkinson identified the suspect as Chai Vang but would give no details. Vang is from St. Paul, Minn., said Paul Schnell, a spokesman for the St. Paul police department.

The shooting started when two hunters returning to their rural cabin saw the suspect in one of their hunting platforms in a tree, Sawyer County Chief Deputy Tim Zeigle said. The platforms or "tree stands" allow hunters to see deer without being easily seen themselves.

Both of those hunters were wounded and one of them radioed friends at the cabin a quarter-mile away. Other members of their group responded and they also were shot, he said.

"It's absolutely nuts. Why? Over sitting in a tree stand?" asked Zeigle.

Zeigle said the suspect was "chasing after them and killing them," with a SKS 7.62 mm semiautomatic rifle, a common hunting weapon. Wisconsin's statewide deer gun hunting season started Saturday and lasts for nine days.

About 20 shots were fired but it was unclear if any of the hunters had fired at the suspect or who might have shot first, Zeigle said. There was just one gun among the eight people killed or wounded, he said.

The dead included a a teenage boy and a woman, and a father and son, Zeigle said. Some of the victims were shot more than once. All five were from the Rice Lake area, about 15 miles southwest of Birchwood in northwestern Wisconsin, he said.

Authorities found two bodies near each other and the others were scattered over 100 yards.

The suspect, who did not have a compass, got lost in the woods and two other hunters who didn't know about the shootings helped him find his way out, Zeigle said.

The man was arrested when he emerged from the woods and a Department of Natural Resources officer recognized the deer license on his back from a description given by one of the shooting victims, Zeigle said.

The man was out of ammunition, he said.

One of the injured hunters was in critical condition Monday at St. Joseph's Hospital in Marshfield. Another was in critical condition and a third in stable condition at Lakeview Medical Center in Rice Lake.

Hunter Bill Wagner, 72, of Oshkosh was about two miles away near Deer Lake with a party of about 20 other hunters when they heard sirens, planes and helicopters and discovered roads in the area had been barricaded.

"When you're hunting, you don't expect somebody to try to shoot you and murder you," Wagner said. "You have no idea who is coming up to you."

"We're all old, dyed-in-wool hunters," he said. "We wouldn't go home because of this, but we will keep it in our minds. We're not forgetting it."

[Daryl (deceased)]

Yep, it's all over the 'net, too.  Very sad indeed.
 
Now we can look forward to more legislation to try and stop things like this from happening.
 
Daryl

[knuckledragger]

I agree with AzKiote, this a train many anti hunters/anti-gun nuts will jump on.  Here's a quote from FOX:

"Zeigle said the suspect was "chasing after them and killing them," with an SKS 7.62 mm semiautomatic rifle,a common hunting weapon."
 
I can see the new Mantra, "Oh, oh, we should have extended the ban to prevent something like this".  I'm sure folks hunt with SKS's (I dont know of any, but I'm sure some do), but I would have to say the quote from FOX was made by someone with an agenda.  
 
I'm interested to hear the back ground on this guy.  Any one want to take guess's as to his history?  That's pretty good shooting, one guy taking out them many opponents, especially when exposed in a treestand.  I know if deer shot back, I wouldn't limit myself by getting in a tree.
 
KD

[Daryl (deceased)]

Chances are good that this guy has a prior felony record. Let's face it, law abiding gun owners don't go out and murder other folks over a tree stand!
 
If he DOES in fact have a prior felony record, he wasn't legally allowed to have a firearm in the first place, but that won't ever be reported.
 
The only thing that worries me more than folks like this murderer are the politicians who are out to stop him. This is trajic, but they need to concentrate on punishing the guilty party, not the law abiding gun owners of this great nation.
 
Daryl

[jchunter]

The AP released the name of the suspect as, Chai Vang; they haven't, and probably won't mention anything about his criminal record for a few days. However, as AzKiote mentioned above, if in fact he was is a felon, he would have been forbidden to possess/own any firearms. Although, since this is a case of mutiple counts of homicide and attempt homicide, the madatory firearm sentencing enhancement under both federal law and most state law will be insignificant anyway. Point being, the charges will put him away for life, or if found to be of special circumstances, the death penalty can apply (depending on Wisconsin's laws).

This is a very tragic event for the victims and families, I feel deeply for them. It also  tragic for all hunters/outdoorsmen throughout the country; the anti-hunters/gun owners will be blaming everything but the cold hearted S.O.B. who comitted this crime. I sure hope the authorities of Wisconsin, including, police; prosecutors; politicians; citizens (Jurors); ect make this case what it is, an isolated and rare occurence. They need to make an example out of the suspect and in no way place blame on anyone or anything but him!I have been a police officer for 6 1/2 years and never get use to this type of indecent crime(s), especially when it effects my passion, which keeps me sane and away from my job when off duty.  Sorry to rant and rave, I know I'm preaching to the choir! Hope you all have/had a good day.


* I feel I must add, that my opinion is based on the assumption that the suspect committed this crime out of malicious intent. In other words, I am not condeming him before all the facts are released, and in no way am I saying he is guilty without his due process.  There is of course, two sides to a story. However, if he did do this out of malicious intent, then my opinion stands!   :D

Jeff

[Dragonfly]

They said on Fox he is Vietnamese.  And was now an American Citizen.  No priors found yet and he had lived in the area for about 15 years..St Paul, MN.
 
They also said he might be suffering from some mental disease but....now wait a minute folks!!!  He knew where to go.  He wasn't around St Paul...he planted himself in a heavily hunted area on private land.  Carrying an assault weapon.  Could he have had a flash back to Vietnam?  Was he a transplanted Viet Nam soldier?  And out to kill Americans?
 
Sounds that way to me.  He had intent to kill.

[jeffnvegas]

how many folks you know hunt with an SKS? Especially deer! guys gotta have some military background to take out that many armed, seasoned hunters. if he's vietnamese and a nut job, send him back to nam. see how they deal with wacko's.

[rockinbbar]

I know ranchers that carry an SKS as an inexpensive alternative to their nicer rifles, for carrying horseback & in the truck. They & other do hunt with them. Just like a Remington semi auto....

You can't blame the gun...

If you give the gun control nuts an inch, they will take all of your guns....BECAUSE soooner or later somone will murder alot of people with a single shot .22 rifle.

Should we call those aasault rifles too, and ban them?

Rockinbbar

[Dragonfly]

Who is blaming the gun Rockin????
 
You guys are sure touchy tonight!!!:D  Hummm cranky? :D :D

[Daryl (deceased)]

Draggy,
 
I keep seeing "he had an assault weapon" echoed all over the news and the 'net, like no one in their right mind would carry such a weapon.  I know of one fella who killed a cow elk on a hunt in east central Arizona a few years ago.  He was hunting with this same type of "assault weapon", and hasn't killed anyone with it, yet owning such a weapon would make him suspect in some liberal's minds.
 
I apologize if I seem touchy, but terms like "assault weapons" and "saturday night specials" are terms invented by the gun grabbing lobby.  They don't belong in the terminology of any self respecting firearms owner IMO.  If anyone doubts this, walk into any respectable gun shop and tell them you want to buy an "assault weapon" or a "saturday night special".  
 
They are terms intended to villify certain "types" of firearms in the eyes of the average, unknowing American, yet the liberals themselves have a hard time coming up with any exact definition for either term.  This, too, is intentional, since the scope of what constitutes either can someday be widened to include ALL firearms.
 
Mi dos centavos, seniora.
 
Az

[rockinbbar]

Draggy,

Nothing was pointed at you or anyone else...LOL.
I was just pointing out that some people actually hunt with SKS rifles. Just because the huy had one doesn't make him fall into any catagory. What he did, does though.

In his case, he was caught tresspassing. He was told to leave & was evidently not stable, & shot the hunters.

I just hate to see the liberal media phrases like "assault weapon" coined by the general public. The activists that want to take our guns will portrait this to the public with such malice that it can only be percieved as detrimental to hunters & gun owners of ANY sort.

While I personally don't use auto-loading rifles in my hunting, we can't let them paint a bad picture of the gun, or hunters either. I'll defend a sportsman's right to use the weapon of their choice for hunting.....

On the same thought, I will defend to the death if needed, the right we all have not to be murdered by a sicko like those hunters were.

Rockin'

[Hunterbug]

The count is up to 6 now. From what I saw they asked him to leave and he was doing so when he fiddeled with his rifle, turned and opened fire. I hope that they go for the death penalty on this guy.
 
 I also agree with RockinBBar. I don't use semi-autos except for a 22 for rabbits but I belive that should others wish to they have that right. I also think that he could have done just as much damage with a pump or with practice a bolt action. I can work a bolt pretty darn quick. That comes from all the times that I've missed and needed the subsiquent shot. :o

[jeffnvegas]

i have no quams with semi-auto or any weapons owned and used by responsible citizens. my point was, and i firmly believe, an SKS is not the weapon of choice for taking game (one shot one kill) in fair chase hunting. you know as well as i do that no matter what we believe or espouse regarding the second amendment that anti-gunners are gonna interpret things in there own way and push for a total ban. however, my position is let's not give them another excuse by misuse of semi's. there are several semi-auto hunting rifles on the market which are made to do the job. SKS rifles are inexpensive throw aways made as production rifles for third world countries. come on have you ever fired one? the only ones i've seen that could keep shots consistently on the paper were totally tweaked and accurized which didn't come cheap. if i ever get lucky enough to draw a bull elk tag i'm sure not gonna take my trusty (ha) SKS.

[knuckledragger]

I think alot of us are saying kinda the same thing here.  If someone wants to hunt with an AK, SKS, whatever legal firearm, so be it.  My concern is that uneducated or agenda-driven anti-gun types will use this incident with an "assault rifle" as leverage to impact our other fireamrs of choice for hunting.  In my mind, it should be stressed that it is viable and legal weapon with which to hunt (though not common), but it is the individual behind the weapon that needs to be focused on.  There are probably thousands of such situations in the hunting woods every year that are not solved with gunfire.  



KD

[Dragonfly]

I agree. Any one can hunt with what ever he wants as long as they follow their state regulations.
 
The problem I have is with the killer...not the gun. He walked into a posted private hunting land and decided to make camp in a tree stand on said land. Hunters coming into the land, legally, saw him and asked him to leave. He climbed out of the tree stand, adjusted his rifle( apparently moving the sight or removing the sight) and turned on the hunters ( unarmed) but carrying thier supplies to the cabin on the land.
 
I think he had an agenda. That's all I'm saying...he had an intent and an agenda.
 
In discussing the weapon he chose I fear I have "tiptoed into an area where angels fear to tread".