NEED HELP- Knives

[Rohann]

I'm going to be buying a knife fairly soon, either a USMC Ka-Bar or a Mk3 Mod O SEAL's knife. I have a few questions regarding these two:
They are both the same price, so that is not a factor. I am wondering which would be of the best quality. The Ka-Bar is made of 1095 Steel while the Mk3 is made of 440A steel. According to this chart:http://www.knifeart.com/tabofdifstee.html, 1095 steel has more carbon in it meaning that it can potentially be sharper and keep it's edge more, however, it has no chromium in it which helps protect against rust, improves durability and increases hardness and tensile strength (440A has this). The Ka-Bar also has less maganese, which increases tensile strength and durability, which also de-oxidizes and de-gasifies to remove oxygen from molten metal. The Ka-Bar alos lacks other quantities which can be found on the chart.
According to these factors and what they actually do, which would you recommend buying? Also, which one is likely to be harder, tougher, more resistant to corrosion and potentially hold it's edge the longest? (I personally like the look and design of the SEAL's knife better but...)

Thanks,
-Rohann

[m gardner]

The big question is why are you buying this knife? For hunting I like my Cold Steel Master Hunter in AUS 8 steel. It holds an  edge well but sharpens easily. A knife that holds an edge forever but is difficult to sharpen is a real pain in the field when it gets dull. 440 stainless is easy to sharpen and touch up as you work too. The Master Hunter has a stainless blade about 5 inches long and handles well. Remember that any steel will rust. Stainless just takes a bit longer to damage. God bless.
        Mark

[Gmoney]

I like a Gerber and Kershaw.......oh wait!  That wasn't an option was it.......

[Daryl (deceased)]

440A steel isn't known to be the best of steels for holding an edge, and most of your "cheaper" made stainless steel knives are made with this.  It's a fairly soft steel, and while it is more rust resistant than carbon steel, it isn't nearly as hard.  It's an ok steel of average quality.  In a 440 steel, I prefer 440C, but it's harder to work with when the knife is made and so will cost more.
 
I personally like carbon steel knives, but you DO have to take care of them.  They're prone to rusting, so treat them accordingly.  I have a Marbles Fieldcraft knife that's made of ball bearing steel (52100), and while it will rust if I don't take care of it, I've had no problems with that.  It also holds an edge better than any other knife I've ever used.  I once skinned, quartered, and de-boned an antelope with this knife, and then later in the fall did the same with an elk, and never sharpened the blade until after I finished the elk.  Even then the blade was still fairly sharp, but not as sharp as when I started.  I slight touch up and I was ready to go again.  In Alaska I skinned a grizzly, a caribou, and then quartered the caribou with the same results.
 
Gerber, Buck (Buck knives can be hard to sharpen), Kershaw, Bench Made, Spyderco, and several others make good quality blades that are considered to be "stainless".  Of the two you mention, I'd take the Ka-bar, but that would be for what I use a knife for.  Much will depend on your usage.
 
As a note, adding chromium to steel doesn't make the steel harder.  It actually makes it softer; the more chromium content, the softer the steel usually is.  At the same time, it makes the blade more rust resistant and more prone to bending under stress rather than snapping (very hard steel will snap because it's also pretty brittle).
 
FWIW,
Daryl

[M1Garand]

Rohann, you're starting to worry me...are you going on a covert operation?   In all seriousness...all the knives mentioned are good knives.  And it depends what you are using it for as the usage may make one a better choice than another.  I'd probably go with the Ka-Bar if those are your only choices.

[Jay Edward (deceased)]

Like some of the others... I prefer carbon steel for sharpening in the field.  I carry 3 knives when I hunt... 2 of them are folding but they are large.  If I have to do an Elk, I need to be able to sharpen as I go along.

The knives themselves: 1 is a straight hunting knife with a longer than usual grip for moving through hard material.  1 is curved for skinning. 1 is my pocket knife for jobs that do not require me to waste the edge on my hunting knives.

I have several 'survival' type knives and they have 2 sharp edges or are sharpened back for a third of the distance on the top.  I do not like 'drop point' knives.  Straight or clipped for me.

None of my knives exceeds 16 inches overall but I do prefer a 6 to 8 inch blade in any event.  Most of my pocket knives are a little longer than usual.

[Daryl (deceased)]

Jay said...

I carry 3 knives when I hunt...

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Hmm...and I carry three knives with me every day. :)

One's a Buck 321 in a pocket (folding bird hook type knife.  Don't need the hook, but I like the thin blade), a small Kershaw clip knife (clipped to the top of my right front pocket), and a Leatherman Wave.  When I hunt, I just add the Marble's for turning animals into meat.

A fella just never knows when he might need a good knife.

Daryl

Daryl

[Rohann]

Thanks guys!
I talked to a few other guys before this and they also said that 440A wasn't so good and the blood groove and saw weakens the knife quite a bit, so I looked into some other knives. I like quite a few of the Ka-Bars (1095 Carbon steel), a few SOG's, but not the Spyderco's so much. I do like blackened steel (I think it looks cooler :P), and I've found quite a few blackened ones on the Ka-Bar site (M1: Maybe I am! You never know...).
 
Of the companies I've looked at I like the Ka-Bars the best (http://www.ka-bar.com/, look at the fixed blade military/tactical knives), but I'll look at a few more companies (a few more Buck knives as well).
 
What do you think of Ka-Bar knives? Are they fairly high up on the list? Would you recommend buying one (are they overpriced?)? The reason I mention the Ka-Bar knives so much is that I know for a fact that the USMC uses them (and the US Army?), I know they are good quality and they will be the easiest to find at the Army Surplus store near here.
 
-Rohann
 
P.S: I also carry a few knives as well. A 3" cheapo folding knife, a 1.5" stainless knife, and I used to have one or two (or 3) butterfly knives but I sold them. (Oh, these are everyday knives, not just while hunting.)

[knuckledragger]

Rohann-  I have carried my same KBar for 20 years around the world in all sorts of terrain and climates.  If you are looking for a good, strong utility knife that holds an edge, then the KBar works.  After 20 years the only problem with it is the handguard is a little loose, but then again, my days of stealth are over anyway.  You definately need to care for it or it will rust, but like any weapon or tool, if you care for it properly, it'll serve you well.  I carried it hunting when I first got it and found it to be a pain skinning animals, so I switched to Buck knives.  I carry the KBar in civilian life if I am going to be in the woods for an extended period.  Knives (and I am no expert) are made for specific reasons and the KBar was made for fighting/utility and it has proved itself in those uses.  If your primary reason is hunting, buy one built for that.
 
One additional thing, the sheath for the KBar is cheap and flimsy and the tip will wear out ( I have a scar on my thigh to prove it).  Get it, toss it and have a nice one made.  I went through 5, usually getting a hookup from unit armorers for new ones.  I had a nice one made for coming over here and I'll be dead and in the ground before this new one wears out.
 
KD

[Stryker]

Rohann,
I to have my Ka-Bar from my days in the Marines and I too have carried it hunting with me and for use around the camp. As a camp knife it is excellent, as a skinning knife it has a lot to be desired. About the only use I found in hunting was it worked well in cutting thru the pelvic bone and brisket. I only used it once as a skinner, after that I bought a Ka-bar Hunter knife. They also make a Skinner and one they call the Little Finn. The hunter knife fit my hand perfectly though. It holds an edge very well, and works great on deer and small animals as well. It was a little awkard on fish, but then again it's a hunting knife not a fillet knife. Expect to pay about $50 - $60 if you want the basic combat knife and $35-$40 for the Hunter or Skinner.
 
The Hunter

[Rohann]

Thanks guys.
About the Ka-Bar sheath: I'm thinking of getting the glass filled nylon sheath. Any comments on it?
I'm probably going to end up getting a skinning knife seperately anyways, so skinning ability isn't much of an issue to me. From the way the Mk3 looked, though, it seemed it would be able to skin fairly well.
 
-Rohann

[Stryker]

Rohann,

the sheath you see in the photo is the same one I got in 1983. Leather is pretty easy to keep. I clean mine with saddle soap then rub it down with some mink oil. They do make 2 different kinds of sheaths for the Ka-bar. One uses staples at the pressure points the one I have uses rivets. The threads did come loose in mine, but it was no problem to restitch using some heavy duty waxed thread. I've had no problems since.

[knuckledragger]

Rohann-  Sorry, never really looked at that sheath. I'm kinda of a traditional guy and I like the leather sheaths.  Good ones last forever.  On the leather KBar sheath, the stiching never came undone on any of them.  The problem I had was the they are pliable and the tip of the sheath would bend, and in the process rub up against the point of the blade.  They always end up wearing through after a few years of hanging on your 782 gear, and eventually all the duct tape in the world wont prevent you getting a good poke in the thigh (if that's where you carry it).
 
KD

[buckshot roberts]

Stryker, i have a ka-bar just like that one, I take an old winchester made in 1927, it's a folding knife with about a 5 inch bl.

[Rohann]

Thanks all.
Mark: I love that combination! If only that was legal here...*sigh*. I think the knife I may be getting comes with a Nylon or Cordura sheath as well though, so I might just go for that.
Well I think I've narrowed it down to either the D2 Impact Combat, the D2 extreme fighting/utility knife or mayyyyybe one of the other ones. I like the D2 steel but I have some questions about the https://www.kabar.com/product_detail.jsp?productNumber=1464&mode=category&categoryId=1,3,7,9&categoryName=Military/Tactical and the https://www.kabar.com/product_detail.jsp?productNumber=1281:
-Difference in steel: is D2 harder to sharpen than 1095?
-Difference in finish: Are they both black/will the black finish scratch or wear off? Is black oxide a better finish?
-Difference in Grind: The impact combat is hollow while the other is a flat grind. Is one harder to sharpen than the other? Will one get sharper than the other/hold it's edge better than the other?

Thanks a lot guys, the info is much appreciated.

-Rohann

[Stryker]

Rohann,
the hollow grind will stay sharper longer, but it is harder to sharpen. You need a sharpening wheel to put a hollow grind on. If you use a stone to sharpen it, you'll have to put a new edge on it. I put a flat edge on a knfe of mine that came hollow ground a few years ago and it was quite a bit of work with just stones. My dad has a wheel and keeps his knives sharp enough to shave with.

[Rohann]

Thanks. Can a hollow grind be potentially sharper than a flat grind, or will it just stay sharp longer?
 
-Rohann

[Rohann]

Okay, well after some very thought-provoking coin flipping, I've decided on the D2 Extreme Fighting/Utility knife. What do you guys think?
 
-Rohann

[buckshot roberts]

Rohann, Hey with me it's the good ole Ka-Bar, When I was in the Phillippines get'n my jungle train'n, I got my hands on one of those old Batangas knifes, not like that junk you see today, but with horn handles, Had to give her up to the M.P.'s, Before I left.