47 year old reloader save

[sakorick]

I was talking to my friend Jim the other day about reloading 12 ga and mentioned how much I liker my old Pacific DL105. He said that he had an old Pacific 12 ga single stage reloader and if I was interested, that I could have it gratis. I said sure and drove over to his house to pick it up. It had been sitting in the corner of his garage for close to 35 years, home to several spiders. I spent most of the better part of a day removing rust and disassembly/inventory. I was surprised at how well it cleaned up. It is a model DL155 and I ordered 4 new bushings from Hornady as their current shotshell reloader still uses the Old Pacific basic parts which they bought out in 1971. The good features are numerous as Pacific was way ahead of it's time. It has a semi-automatic primer feed, first stage resizer/deprimer, extra large shot/powder holders, spiral motion first stage crimper that always starts the crimp exactly in the original crimp pattern and well a designed powder and shot drop system. I also ordered new rubber O rings for the slide which should arrive along with the bushings soon. Once fully operational I will retire the MEC650 as in my advanced years find I have no need for a progressive machine. These old Pacific reloaders were built to last!

[farmboy]

Is it in 12 gauge? I have a brand new set of tooling for a 12 gauge  dl155.

[sakorick]

Yes, 12 Ga. What does the tooling consist of?

[farmboy]

Everything to make it load 12 gauge the shot drop tube the depriming rod the shell holders everything that screws into the too and bottom of the press.

[farmboy]

The one to the right of the primer station the base is spring loaded.

[sakorick]

The one to the right of the primer station the base is spring loaded.

Yes.....That's the one that tells you your wad pressure. 20-40 pounds is good for all reloads. You can adjust the amount of pressure by raising(lowers) or lowering(raises) the wad pressure. The whole idea is that you want some pressure on the powder so the wad is making good contact. It also makes for a perfect final crimp. It takes some minor tweaking to get a good crimp. The old Pacific reloaders are near perfect when everything is set correctly and the good news is that it lasts forever.....unless you change any of the components!

[sakorick]

My first box of shells....no oops, no problems whatsoever. Make a factory roll crimp....I love this thing!

[farmboy]

Better looking than I could make with mine! Nice job. Not sure how mec ended up with almost of of the shot shell reloader market not that is anything wrong with them but they did end up with most of it just as Dillon ended up with the pistol loader market.

[gitano]

Those look great, Rick!

That's not a "roll crimp" though. It 'rolls 'em over' nicely, but a "roll crimp" looks like this: https://www.google.com/search?q=shotgun+shell+roll+crimper&espv=2&biw=1745&bih=857&tbm=isch&imgil=-nixBhbRqDj0lM%253A%253BDdfMuA5FNRT7PM%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.ballisticproducts.com%25252FOriginal-Roll-Crimping-Tool-12ga%25252Fproductinfo%25252FROLL12%25252F&source=iu&pf=m&fir=-nixBhbRqDj0lM%253A%252CDdfMuA5FNRT7PM%252C_&usg=__RQtVPhsW-0ypWkxBBjuWhTGKSHc%3D&ved=0ahUKEwjI_qWt1fjKAhUM2GMKHQI1Df0QyjcIOA&ei=dTDBVojwEIywjwOC6rToDw#imgrc=-nixBhbRqDj0lM%3A

Paul

[sakorick]

Paul, you are correct. I use the term roll crimp as true roll crimps became obsolete when the "Pie" crimp was invented by Richard Lee in 1957. He called the new crimp a Pie crimp and his cheap reloader started thousands of people reloading shotshells. The pie crimp made roll crimps obsolete and then Winchester came out with their old AA one piece hull which reloaders loved as not only did they make a perfect factory style crimp but lasted for many many reloads. Then they changed the one piece hull to a two piece hull which is a throwaway after about 2 or 3 reloads. Many of the big boys are using the Remington Gold hull now for reloading as they are a true one piece hull and you can reload them forever it seems. My old DL155 makes a finished lip that looks like the old roll crimp with an 8 sided pie which replaced the old roll crimp paper over shot wad.

[farmboy]

All I know is my dl155 I could make decent crimps but not perfect ones like that. Well done perhaps I was hastey replacing mine. The other thing that press is great for is building special hunting loads.easy to add under or overshot cards buffer Mylar wraps. All those things are easy to do as you can take the shell out at any station .

[sakorick]

That's because I am using the Hodgdon recipe for a factory AA load and AA hulls. Here is a cost break down for 12 and 20 ga price/ box to reload. By the way I don't count the hull cost as I picked up thousands of once fired AA and Rem gold hulls at various ranges for free.

12 gauge, 1 1/4 ounce heavy field load per box of 25
Primer       .37
Powder   2.14
Shot        2.85
total.......$5.36                  $53.60/case    

20 gauge 1 ounce heavy field load per box of 25
Primer         .37
Powder      1.20
Shot           2.36
Total.........$3.93 $39.30/case

28 ga 3/4 oz field loads estimate <$3.00/box

12 and 20 gauge heavy field cases on line run approximately $120 to $160(for 28Ga) delivered and you will usually pay taxes. The Walmart stuff is total junk as most of it will not cycle a SA. All this stuff was 1/2 the price you see here 6 years ago. That's because Obama closed down our last lead plant and we have to buy it from Chile.

[gitano]

You're going to have to use units on all your numbers, Rick, because I can't tell if you're talking pennies or dollars. For example:

Primer .37 (Is this dollars or cents? I can't make 'sense' of it either way as I pay about $2 for a box of 100 primers making them $.02 each or two cents a piece. Not $.37 dollars a piece, not 37 cents a piece and not 0.37 cents a piece??)
Powder 2.14 (Is that two dollars and 14 cents per cartridge!?)
Shot 2.85 (Is that two dollars and 85 cents per cartridge?)
On a "cent" basis, I get a total of .37 + 2.14 + 2.85 = 4.9937 cents per cartridge or $1.248425 dollars per box of 25. Sumpin's off somewhere.

Paul

PS - I think I 'reverse engineered' it: Those are dollar units, but the total for the box of 25 as stated with "per box of 25".

Paul

[gitano]

By the way, prices of lead from Chile are and were HALF the price of the lead from the US.

I bought some 16 ga and 28 ga cases (10 boxes of 25 rounds each for a total of 250 rounds) recently from Cabelas. I paid $68 for the 16s and $80-something for the 28s. I was tickled pink! This is the cheap South American stuff for sure, but I don't have to worry about 'cycling' a side-by-side, and they've killed everything I've shot at so far. I bought two cases of each gauge, and so I probably have a "life-time's supply" given my use. Considering my "expertise" () in reloading shotshells, and the cost of these from Cabelas, it's difficult for me to justify reloading.

Paul

PS - I went and checked the boxes and I may have been wrong about the country of origin: The 28s are "Federal", (but I still think they are S.A.), and the 16s are "Herters", so they could be S.A. Both were shipped from places in the US. The Federal ammo from Federal warehouse in Wisconsin, and the Herters from Waseca, Minnesota. Here's a nauseating 'review' on Herters ammo from the NRA: http://www.americanhunter.org/articles/2013/10/9/herters-select-grade-ammo/

Paul

PS - Apparently the Herters shotshells are made in Italy by Cheddite. I found the following an interesting read: http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=360210

Reviews appear to be either "love" or "hate" at this site:http://reviews.cabelas.com/8815/218437/herters-field-and-target-loads-per-case-reviews/reviews.htm I wonder if the "bad performances" were associated with the firearm? I didn't see ANY good reviews on the .410 stuff. Apparently the crimps can't handle shipping.

Paul

[farmboy]

Paul I think ricks prices are per box of 25. At least that is what I thought when I read it and I think that about works out as well.

[farmboy]

That interesting as well fiocchi is Italian andcheddite is French unless they also have a plant in Italy.

[gitano]

I don't pay much attention to shotshell 'stuff', and even less to reloading or quality of ammo. If it 'shoots', I'm pretty much OK with it. Again, I'm neither a competitive or even recreational 'target' shotgun shooter. I have shot several hundred trap 'birds' in my life, but not a thousand, and maybe about the same of skeet. There are LOTS of folks that shoot that much in a month!

Paul

PS - Rick makes 'em for about 21 cents per round, I can buy them at Cabelas for 27 cents a round. I'm OK with the extra 6 cents a round. If I could get the rifle ammo I WANT for that differential AND it shot a good as my reloads, I'd probably have to give up reloading. HOWEVER, 'high powered' rifle ammo - even the ubiquitous .30-06 or .300 Win Mag ammo - is AT LEAST $2 per round up here. There isn't a snowball's chance in hell that ammunition manufacturing industry will EVER make the rifle ammo I want. Fifteen or 20 years ago, a fellow I know bought a Marlin "Alaskan Guide Gun" (PTOOEY) in .45-70 Gov't. A box of 20 factory loads was $78. I was floored! I offered to reload for him, telling him that I could do it for about $12 per box of 20. He couldn't believe it and declined my offer. Gotta love the brainwashing of gunwriters (ptooey)!

Paul

PPS - I think comparing the ammo I bought with Rick's handloads wasn't exactly comparing "real" apples to apples above. I "don't care" about shotgun ammo as long as it shoots. On the other hand, Rick's handloads are "premium" ammo. I'm sure factory ammo of comparable quality would be at least three times as much.

Paul