>> 6.5 mm -- is this the "perfect" caliber ?

Started by LLANOJOHN (deceased), January 14, 2005, 03:22:22 PM

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sakorick

#30
I'm a new guy here, however, IMHO...there is no perfect caliber. It depends upon what you are hunting and the range you expect to be shooting. My brother's first deer rifle was a 6.5 x 55 swede. Nice gun but not my pick for a cross canyon Elk shot. I definitely wouldn't take one on a brown bear hunt. For a 300 yard and in deer rifle the numbers are good. My 2 cents....regards, Rick. OBTW...My deer rifle is a Steyr 7x57....it ain't perfect but at my old  age, it's nice shooting a cartridge that doesn't hurt me as much as the deer!!
Talk to yourself. There are times you need expert advice.

Timberghozt

Hey Ol John.Howdy neighbor.I am thinking seriously about having a chamber cut for a 6.5-284.I haven`t made up my mind yet for sure.It is still up in the air versus having a 6mm-284.I sure like the looks of that 6.5-284 though.It may win out in the end.

kombi1976

If you're tossing up which one to have your rifle chambered in go the 6.5/284. It's an established cartridge and the cases are comercially available from Norma(correct me if I'm wrong) if you aren't interested in necking down your own. Plus it has a good history of long distance accuracy. Remember that 6.5 cal just happens to be an excellent cal for ballistic coefficient and sectional density. It's also about the bottom cal you want to use for an all round cartridge.

IMHO of course. ;)
Cheers & God Bless
22lr ~ 22 Hornet ~ 25-20 ~ 303/25 ~ 7mm-08 ~ 303 British ~ 310 Cadet ~ 9.3x62 ~ 450/400 N.E. 3"


LLANOJOHN (deceased)

sakorick-Timberghozt-Kombi1976-et al,
 
Thanks for your posts gents! My apologies for not getting to the "particular cartridges" promptly as I had hoped. Remember that my original title was the "perfect caliber"! My earlier post concerning particular cartridges I wanted to say a few words about are on order and I hope for them to be arriving soon, the 6.5/284 is one of them.
 
QuoteI definitely wouldn't take one on a brown bear hunt.
sakorick...neither would I and that includes polar bears, neighbor! But for everything else, from prairie dogs to moose, there is a cartridge and a particular 6.5 bullet that will do the job required and do it exceeding well. We will discuss this subject in more detail when I finally get the pics done.
 
Best regards,
 
Ol' John..:D ..;) ..:cool:
Life Member-NRA-TSRA
Riflesmith-Bolt & Lever Centerfires Only
Left-Hand Creek Rifles
Mark Twain was right-"There is no such thing as too much good whiskey!"
My best advice.."Best to stay outta trees and offa windmills!"

kombi1976

Quote from: HondoJohn6508Quote:
I definitely wouldn't take one on a brown bear hunt.
sakorick...neither would I and that includes polar bears, neighbor!
Well, this may freak you out a little.......the Finns were using 6.5x55 to shoot polar bears up in the Artic Circle in the early 20th century before all the big magnums were developed and before everyone said only a real barrel-burning-big-bore(cool alliteration ;) ) could kill bears. :eek:
Yep, freaky, eh.
I won't say the 6.5 Swede isn't capable of it because in terms of penetration 6.5 seems to be an excellent performer, but you'd really want to make that first shot count......:confused:
Cheers & God Bless
22lr ~ 22 Hornet ~ 25-20 ~ 303/25 ~ 7mm-08 ~ 303 British ~ 310 Cadet ~ 9.3x62 ~ 450/400 N.E. 3"


Timberghozt

Hey Ol John.Pardon my inducition of cartridge choice of the 6.5mm diameter bullet. Actually I am interested in it in a few facets too include either the 6.5 -06, 264WM or 6.5-284.I have never played with the 6.5 diameter.So it will be a learning experience for me.

just russ

2ndtimer. I also have a Howa 1500 that did'nt group under 2 1/2 until I did two things. First make sure the barrel is floated all the way. The fellow at Legacy told me they don't float them for cosmetic reasons. The other is to put a piece of duct tape on the stock flat behind where the recoil lug fits. This allows better fit without any stress on the action. Hope it works for you.

LLANOJOHN (deceased)

Quote from: TimberghoztHey Ol John.Pardon my inducition of cartridge choice of the 6.5mm diameter bullet. Actually I am interested in it in a few facets too include either the 6.5 -06, 264WM or 6.5-284.I have never played with the 6.5 diameter.So it will be a learning experience for me.
Good to see you here.  The cartridges that I am waiting on should be here tomorrow or Thursday.  Just read an interesting article by John Barsness on the ".264 Win Magnum":p  and I must say it was interesting and informative.  We will be getting to that particular 6.5 cartridge very soon.
 
Ol' John;)
Life Member-NRA-TSRA
Riflesmith-Bolt & Lever Centerfires Only
Left-Hand Creek Rifles
Mark Twain was right-"There is no such thing as too much good whiskey!"
My best advice.."Best to stay outta trees and offa windmills!"

m gardner

The 6.5's are my second favorite group of cartridges. I've owned 2, 6.5x55's, a 264 win. mag., and a 260 rem. They were all acurate rifles the 264 the best , averaging under moa with most any load I fed it. I shot deer with it and the bullets usually blew up unless noslers were used. The little 6.5's at 2400 to 2700 with 140 and 160 grain bullets actually killed as well and ruined less meat. The 264 didn't seem to shoot much flatter than my 270s ( and was heavy )so I gave it to my son who still has it. He was a Marine and is tough enough to own it. God bless and good hunting.

klallen

Quote from: HondoJohn6508Just read an interesting article by John Barsness on the ".264 Win Magnum"     ...     we will be getting to that particular 6.5 cartridge very soon.

:eek:
 
Please clear something up for me.  Are you saying that you are looking to buy yourself a .264 WinMag very soon or you're just looking to talk about the cartridge very soon here on THL.
 
Careful how you choose to answer that question.  One unexpected answer (and I'm sure you know which one that would be) and I'd be knocked plumb off my chair !!!  ;o)
 
Take it easy, HONDO.  >>  klallen

LLANOJOHN (deceased)

Quote from: klallen:eek:
 
Please clear something up for me. Are you saying that you are looking to buy yourself a .264 WinMag very soon or you're just looking to talk about the cartridge very soon here on THL.
 
Careful how you choose to answer that question. One unexpected answer (and I'm sure you know which one that would be) and I'd be knocked plumb off my chair !!! ;o)
 
Take it easy, HONDO. >> klallen
klallen,
 
No worries, amigo........you do not have to be concerned about "knocked plumb off my chair!!!" --I would not want to take responsibility for any such event. However, I will take responsibility for the "eyes widening and staggering back a few steps" with the statement of......"a definite NO...to a perhaps MAYBE!!"! That should give you a great pause to reconsider your personal brand of bourbon and life as we know it! When we get to that part of this diatribe of mine concerning the 6.5 caliber, I will elicit most strenuously your personal input as regards the "264 Winchester Magnum", so please be patient.
 
HAR! HAR! HAR!...:D :D :D (I am laughing with you..not at you!)
 
Ol' John;)
Life Member-NRA-TSRA
Riflesmith-Bolt & Lever Centerfires Only
Left-Hand Creek Rifles
Mark Twain was right-"There is no such thing as too much good whiskey!"
My best advice.."Best to stay outta trees and offa windmills!"

NCBullshooter

Hello all,

 
I, like many on this forum, have been considering a 6.5 and specifically have been researching the differences between a 6.5x55 and a 6.5-06.  I reload and will be using a Charles Daly standard long action for the rifle.  
 
My question is this, for the 6.5-06 and using 140 gr. bullets, it seems that I would lose some case capacity in the 6.5-06 since I believe 140 grainers would not be able to be seated out very far and still fit in the magazine.  Since the 6.5x55 case is shorter and the bullets can be seated out further and still fit in the magazine, can I end up with similar velocities in the 6.5x55 as in the 6.5-06 with 140 gr. bullets?  Also, is the 6.5x55 with a shorter powder column any more "efficient"?
 
Second question:  The base diameter of the 6.5-06 (.30-06) case is .473" and the base diameter of the 6.5x55 case is .479".  I understand that American 6.5x55 brass (Winchester and Remington) is .473", but that Lapua brass is .479".  Since the bolt face of my action is .473", and if I decide to chamber for 6.5x55, is it worth having the bolt face opened-up to use Lapua brass, which I understand is significantly better?
 
Thanks for any thoughts and opinions,
 
NCBullshooter

gitano

Here are my OPINIONS NC. I do not think you can achieve '06 velocites with the 55mm case.
 
I wouldn't even consider for a second, modifying my rifle so I could use Lapua brass. Is Lapua brass good? Sure. Is it better that other brass? I have used it, and I really don't consider it better in ballistic performance. MAYBE if you were shooting long range competition, but othersies, absolutely not.
 
Paul
Be nicer than necessary.

LLANOJOHN (deceased)

#43
NCBullshooter,
 
Good questions and I would certainly agree with Gitano in his assessment. My first question is what is your planned use for the rifle? Second, I have been unable to determine the length of the magazine on the CD action. Nothing is available on the Charles Daly website. Could you possibly measure the length of your magazine box with a caliper?
 
A cartridge with the higher powder capacity will always produce higher velocities, especially with the heavier weight bullets..........but sometimes by not very much. I am researching data at the present time for my continuing posts on the various standards, Ackley Improved and wildcat cartridges that I have rounds for and pictures to post. Probably by late Saturday I will have everything compliled and begin posting my findings. I hope you will stick around until then. The cartridges that will be covered are: 6.5 Grendel, 6.5 BR, 260 Remington and 6.5/08(.260) Ackley Improved, 6.5x55 Swede and Ackley Improved, 6.5x257 Roberts and Ackley Improved (260 AAR), 6.5-06 and Ackley Improved, 6.5x284 and .264 Winchester Magnum. One other cartridge will be covered simply because of its historical context.......the 256 Newton, the first high-intensity 6.5 cartridge that began it all about 90 years ago.
 
Ol' John...:rolleyes: ;) :cool:
Life Member-NRA-TSRA
Riflesmith-Bolt & Lever Centerfires Only
Left-Hand Creek Rifles
Mark Twain was right-"There is no such thing as too much good whiskey!"
My best advice.."Best to stay outta trees and offa windmills!"

NCBullshooter

Thanks Gitano and John,

I appreciate your opinions and I agree that I don't think there would be much to be gained from opening up the bolt face a very small amount to use 6.5x55 Lapua brass.  I have only used Winchester brass up to now and have found it very acceptable for my purposes.  
 
John, I measured the Charles Daly long action's magazine and the internal length dimension is 3.408".  (They show this action as Model #CDGM2206)  Please let me know if you can use any other measurements.  Do you think this length magazine would let me chamber for 6.5-06 and still seat 140 grainers out to where they don't infringe too much on case capacity?
 
I am not a competition shooter, but like most every rifle shooter, I do enjoy small groups.  I enjoy reloading and shoot quite a bit at my local club range.  ( Like Gov. Ventura, I believe gun control should be defined as putting three rounds in the same hole.)  The 6.5 rifle I hope to build will be a longer range deerhunting rifle, hopefully that would be capable of 300-400 yard shots, but only when I'm 100% capable at those distances.  I plan on taking the rifle on a western Mule Deer hunt in the next year or so in Montana, where my brother lives and guides part time.  He tells me 300+ yards are not that uncommon and he hunts with a custom .270 Ackley Improved for both Deer and Elk.  (Although I believe I shoot reasonably well, I do not feel capable yet of shooting at a big game animal from a field position and typical field conditions past 300 yards.)  Mostly I want the new 6.5 rifle to be my "go to" rifle that I become most comfortable with and that I shoot most often.  Also, I want the rifle to fill what I think is a bit of a gap in my battery; I have a Ruger 77 MKII rechambered to .243 Ackley Improved and a .30-06 Ackley Improved built on a Legacy Sports 98 Mauser action that I am close to completing that will be an Elk rifle.  I chose the 6.5 caliber because 6.5 140 grainers will fit well between the 100 grain bullets I commonly use in my .243 and the 180 grainers I intend to use to hunt Elk.  Plus, it's hard to beat the excellent sectional density and BC's of those 6.5 140 grainers.  The hard part is choosing between the 6.5x55 and 6.5-06, or their improved cousins.  The easy part is that I don't think I could go wrong with any of them.  I have never owned one of these calibers so any opinions are much appreciated.
 
Also, does anyone have any other thoughts to consider between the 6.5-06 and 6.5x55?  I am going to order a Shilen chrome moly blank, probably #3 contour, in .264 with a 1-8" twist in the next couple of weeks.  I will not want the barrel any longer than 23 or 24".  Any ideas on instructions to discuss with a gunsmith about chambering? - I have heard that the 6.5x55 reamers out there vary a lot regarding throat lengths?  Would there need to be specific throat instructions for either of these cartridges?  Is it typical for a gunsmith to be able to set a throat if I sent along a dummy cartridge with the bullet set at a particular depth and is this recommended?
 
Thanks again,
 
NCBullshooter

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